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What will the editors of French Vogue think of next?!
So wait, you're going as Ted Danson?
Although I am no advocator of any kind of discrimination but if thats suppose to be T-pain...that's racistly hilarious!
Pure, unadulterated awesomesauce!
wait...i thought mighty boosh was broadcast by bbc, not the australian network....
As someone who's not interested enough in The Mighty Boosh to look up context: is there a way in which this isn't straightforward blackface? That is what this looks like to my admittedly uneducated eye.
Lil' piece of chicken
Might want to watch where you wear that get-up. Could read as blackface minstrelry. And it kind of is, really.
Oh yeah, and since you mentioned the Star Wars Mighty Boosh Mash-up, I am also going to have to post another great Boosh mash-up : No Country for Old Gregg.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQO92omiDQY
I guess its absurdity is part of the joke, so this question is probably pointless, but... why is the Spirit of Jazz represented as a Voodoo/Caribbean/Yoruba god?
That said, I rewatched the skit and it's pretty damn funny.
The spirit of jazz? Blackface + fake dreads?
vile. It doesn't matter where you wear it - it's pathetic (if you don't get why this isn't funny) or vile (if you enjoy the sick feeling blackface inspires and the vicious caricatures it reinforces). .
Assuming good faith & monumental ignorance, just think about where you would or wouldn't feel comfortable wearing this costume. And think about why that is. Have some sense, people!
Hello Dave.
You're my wife now, Dave.
@SamSam,ripley, et al. That's me in the picture. I assume The Spirit of Jazz is the way he is because he's associated with New Orleans and the Voodoo roots that exist there. Seems like a knee-jerk PC reaction to see someone wearing black facepaint and immediately denounce it as racist blackfaced minstrelsy. When I wore the costume out, not a single person mentioned blackface, and I saw a lot of people, so maybe there's something in seeing a photo of it that changes how it's received.
Anyway, thanks for the post, Xeni!
ha ha! ted danson! perfect!
No, context is king.
It isn't intrinsically racist, and America's knee-jerk reaction to anyone with dark face-paint on (regardless of context) is annoying.
There is room for discussion to be had over the merits of this costume, and indeed the symbols and traditions being referenced by it, without the need to jump to black face and racism first.
It isn't intrinsically racist, and America's knee-jerk reaction to anyone with dark face-paint on (regardless of context) is annoying.
I'm trying to think what examples you'd be talking about?
On second thought, you guys are right. The Spirit of Jazz character should have been a white guy in a suit so as not to offend.
On second thought, you guys are right. The Spirit of Jazz character should have been a white guy in a suit so as not to offend.
It *is* a white guy in a suit.
It *is* a white guy in a suit.
You really got me on that one. Pat yourself on the back.
@Neon Tooth
Here's a good example.
http://cakewrecks.blogspot.com/2009/07/christmas-in-july-going-dutch.html
Even the character itself is fairly offensive. "I is the spirit of jazz." That sounds like a stereotype to me. Can you explain how this is different from making your eyes slits and saying "Me so solly"?
You really got me on that one. Pat yourself on the back.
Facts is facts, what can you do.
FWIW, I think Mighty Boosh is just about the best thing on TV right now.
Here's a good example.
http://cakewrecks.blogspot.com/2009/07/christmas-in-july-going-dutch.html
That's pretty gross.
I personally think you did a fabulous job with that costume. My friends and I are going as a set of Noel Fielding characters. We've got The Moon, Old Gregg, The Hitcher, and Vince Noir, and we're all quite sad we don't have anyone playing The Spirit of Jazz to go with us. Kudos to you, it looks great!
For those calling it blackface, well... okay, yes, technically it is. And I realize that's problematic. The Spirit of Jazz is not the only Boosh character in blackface either - Rudy, anyone? But I don't find it offensive in the context of the show, which involves a number of very colorful characters drawn from a wide range of backgrounds, whether ethnic, mythological, zoological, or completely and fantastically imaginary. There's only so much a double act can do to create these bizarre characters without resorting to face-paint.
Can you explain how this is different from making your eyes slits and saying "Me so solly"?
To me, there's a huge difference between an offensive stereotype that is designed to make fun of a certain ethnicity, creed, etc. based on qualities that are perceived to be both intrinsic to that group and undeniably negative, and a character with recognizable traits (speech patterns, make-up, wardrobe) that suit the context of that character's roots and background within a work of fiction. Do you actually think that the character's misconjugation of a verb somehow denigrates an entire group of people based on their historical ethnicity? New Orleans is a place with very unique and flavorful use of language. The character isn't getting its humor from negatively stereotyping New Orleans blacks, unlike your "Me so solly" example that derives its humor from its misguided and mean-spirited stereotype.
This image is so sad and depressing. If you think it's funny I suspect you never bothered to take a look at black history from someone who wasn't white. To the white man in the suit you are parading your ignorance and rallying those like minded ignorant folks to join you in your insulting humor. You say no one mentioned black face when you wore this costume out... doesn't that alone strike you as odd? Perhaps people were uncomfortable calling it what it is: racist humor.
Neon Tooth,
http://boingboing.net/2009/02/10/obama-japan.html
http://boingboing.net/2009/09/18/911-hoax-fools-all-o.html
http://boingboing.net/2008/05/24/we-are-the-world-rem.html
Yep, racist humor. Justify it however you want and shut down criticism by calling is knee-jerk PC reactionary silliness all you want, I know it's effective, and you sit in a boat with Rush and Glenn when you use it. Hurray!
@stupidjerk I know I shouldn't feed the trolls, but since it's actually me in that picture and me you're talking about sitting in a boat with Rush and Glenn, might I suggest that you are no more reasonable or informed in your assertions about those you don't know than they are.
Rhetoric and uninformed name-calling is no way to advance a cause that's otherwise worthy of well-reasoned discussion.
@arkizzle,
A smattering of comments on three stories hardly constitutes some kind of general "American knee jerk reaction". My only recent experience with the subject has been related to the Australian incident in which on every forum I frequent a bunch of Australians were desperately trying to justify what was a truly racist depiction. There was similarly a lot of talk of American's generally being "oversensitive".
I myself am cool with the Might Boosh's bit, although I think it walks a very thin line. I know I wouldn't want to go rolling around my moslty black and latino neighborhood rocking that get up though.
I know I wouldn't want to go rolling around my moslty black and latino neighborhood rocking that get up though.
On that we agree. Blacks and Latinos are *so* prone to acts of physical violence, especially where racial stereotypes are involved.
Chicka-chicka OW!
Sorry @Neon Tooth, but that was too easy to pass up. Anyone who likes the Boosh is good in my book.
Well I would not want to offend anybody if it's relatively easy to avoid, furthermore I'd *speculate* that most people aren't hip to The Might Boosh so I'd be concerned about the possibility of an ass whooping. I'm defintely just guessing on that, just a hunch.
The Spirit of Jazz in context- scene from "The Mighty Boosh"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nv9yCRicano
Baron Samedi?
Neon Tooth,
You genuinely don't think there is an existent trend in the US to immediately condemn-as-racist anyone wearing dark facepaint (in any context), who is not black?
Really?
eyeballkid: Just because you perceive the stereotype as positive doesn't make it okay, and frankly it's not your call to make. (You know, seeing as you're not the one being stereotyped.)
As another example, "everyone knows" Asians are good at math, right? How could that be harmful? Read this: http://www.asianweek.com/2008/05/30/why-being-‘good-at-math’-can-be-a-bad-thing-perpetuating-model-minority-stereotypes-leads-to-resentment-and-anger-toward-asian-americans/
Even if they found a black actor to play the roll, (would that have been so hard?) using a racial stereotype is always lazy humor writing. There's no reason why the "spirit" of that music has to be any particular race, since white musicians adopted the form very early on and currently the biggest supporters of jazz are Japanese and European audiences.
I think knee-jerk "this is racism" reactions are out of place. They do nothing to further discussion, only division.
If we label assumptions white people make about black people solely based on the colour of their skin as racism, then the same should apply the other way.
So, a black person assuming a white person is racist just because they're white is just as bad as a white person assuming a black person is inferior just because they're black.
Screaming racism at anything, without understanding and taking into account context or intent does nothing to close the racial divide.
/Non-white person
There's no reason why the "spirit" of that music has to be any particular race, since white musicians adopted the form very early on and currently the biggest supporters of jazz are Japanese and European audiences.
So "no race" = "white." THAT, my friend, is just silly. Everyone has an ethnic makeup and an ethnic history, even if it doesn't cause their skin to appear "non-white."
Neon Tooth,
You genuinely don't think there is an existent trend in the US to immediately condemn-as-racist anyone wearing dark facepaint (in any context), who is not black?
Really?
Uh no, have Americans been up in arms over Fred Armisen doing Obama on one of the biggest tv shows in the country? Do BoingBoing users have (American),(British) (or whatver) listed after their handles? Did I miss that?
Wow! Judging by the reaction he probably should have dressed up as Old Gregg!
"Do BoingBoing users have (American),(British) (or whatver) listed after their handles? Did I miss that? "
The three commenters in this thread that bring up the blackface issue are from the US.
All your IP-numbers are belong to us.
It's even more offensive that The Boosh do greenface.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0AckvdGbk4w&feature=fvsr
The three commenters in this thread that bring up the blackface issue are from the US.
All your IP-numbers are belong to us.
Well played @arkizzle. BTW, if you're not Japanese, you aren't allowed to quote Zero Wing without offending.
Wow! Judging by the reaction he probably should have dressed up as Old Gregg!
Actually, I wanted to go as Mr. Susan. "Have you seen my mirror balls?", but it was too complicated on short notice. Instead I opted to dress as the next candidate in line for Grand Wizard at the behest of my friends Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck, and my wife, Ann Coulter.
Then again, wouldn't Old Gregg have been offensive to transexual fish-men, since I'm not one myself?
The three commenters in this thread that bring up the blackface issue are from the US.
All three of them eh? Fair enough.
I think it's a really good idea to trust a bunch of British comedians about what is and what is not offensive regarding race in New Orleans, LA. /sarcasm Especially since New Orleans has some of the most complex racial divisions in the United States.
But I will say that the English love Jazz, and are big supporters of New Orleans Jazz. However misguided The Mighty Boosh are, perhaps this character is merely an homage to the great Jazz greats? Maybe?
I don't pretend to know the exact meaning behind "The Spirit of Jazz." I will say that as New Orleanian, I am a little offended-- and it's not so much the black face, although it's part of it.
It's the suggestion of black Jazz musicians as otherworldly, voodoo enchanters that bothers me. There was no magic or primitive powers that created Jazz. The music teachers in our public schools produced great Jazz musicians. In other instances, the community encouraged young people to play music.
The suggestion that blacks had/have this magical voodoo music (Haitian, Yoruba, Senegambian, or whatever) is just a step away from the "primitive animals" argument of 100 years ago. It reinforces the idea that blacks are "the other" and that whites are somehow more evolved.
I've seen this episode on the Mighty B, and honestly I didn't think of blackface once, until I read the comments on this blog. Sure, I'm not from the US or UK so blackface doesn't come into my consciousness much. I see the black face paint as a necessary backdrop for the white facepaint which depicts a stylised skull. I didn't think of it as signifying that the character was supposed to have dark skin. Would it have been less controversial to have used a dark-skinned actor, instead of a white actor for this role? I'm not being facetious, I'm just not schooled on the intricacies of this debate.
Blackface is a specific make-up style, which involves exaggerating the lips. This isn't it. Google blackface and look at the images.
Why assume that because the U.S. commenters bring up blackface is because the U.S. is overly sensitive and too P.C.? Might it also indicate a long and painful history re: racism and an overwhelming desire to move beyond it?
Blackface means different things depending on where you are in the world. It's a cultural difference, not a sensitivity difference.
(full disclosure) As stated, I am from New Orleans. But why give Americans such a hard time about being PC? It's great you believe that you don't have to worry about racial stereotypes in your country and that this type of entertainment should meet zero challenge.
But I must insist that challenging the appropriateness of these types of things is good for our society. It keeps us aware of social differences, and helps us learn about the differences in other cultures.
I love Boosh, but I liked the character better when it's name was Papa Lazarou on the League of Gentlemen http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Papa_Lazarou
the 2 boosh episodes where the Spirit of Jazz is a main character first set up the voodoo/otherworldly archetype, then through events they later unravel that archetype, effectively making the Spirit seem just like a human again, and not a particularly black one at that.
For the most part, most boosh characters tend towards the fantastic and the non-stereotypical (Old Gregg is a "scaly man-fish" with a "mangina," Tony Harrison is a pair of inverted pink testicles with octopus tentacles). Considering how many hundreds of characters they've created, it would be near impossible to avoid some accidental stereotype, and I do think the Spirit of Jazz was more accidental than any explicit attempt at reviving minstrelsy.
Out of context, though, it's just am image, and for any image there are countless interpretations. Austin could be wearing this costume in tribute to his favorite show, someone else could wear it as a critique of blackface, and another person could wear it in order to parody black people. But the intention doesn't necessarily come through as clearly as the striking visual image.
I see the black face paint as a necessary backdrop for the white facepaint which depicts a stylised skull.
A good point.
For the most part, most boosh characters tend towards the fantastic and the non-stereotypical.
Another good point.
Even if they found a black actor to play the roll, (would that have been so hard?)
It would have been hard to find a black Noel Fielding, yes. Most of the characters on that show are played by two people. Inserting another actor into a Noel/Julian scene would alter the dynamic significantly.
Richard Ayoade of The IT Crowd has a recurring character (and helped originate the series), and he's a Gin-U-Wine Black Person, so I suppose they could have tapped him. I can't really see him as the Spirit of Jazz, though, and I can't imagine it would have helped your perceptions. But perhaps you should write him a letter telling him why it should have been him and not Noel.
I'm seeing a lot of people passing judgment on the Boosh without, as far as I can tell, ever having seen a full episode. I don't know about you, but to me that's not all that different from fundamentalists condemning books they haven't read. Watch a few episodes, see what they're up to, then come back.
The "Magic Negro." THis is what I was trying to remember when I typed my first comment.
From the page: "Magical negro" films thus function to marginalize black agency, empower normalized and hegemonic forms of whiteness, and glorify powerful black characters in so long as they are placed in racially subservient positions.
Link: http://caliber.ucpress.net/doi/abs/10.1525/sp.2009.56.3.543
As someone who's not interested enough in The Mighty Boosh to look up context: is there a way in which this isn't straightforward blackface?
Herein lies the problem. Not interested enough to educate oneself, but interested enough to loudly express an uneducated opinion.
I guess the Evil Cockney is still up for grabs...
Anybody got a problem with greenface?
perfectly said, Lerasmus!
Richard Ayoade couldn't appear in series one for contractual reasons, so he couldn't have been the Spirit of Jazz. Just thought I'd point that out.
Even if he had, though, would it be any less offensive? The character is an evil fool with a thick accent, and basically perpetuates the Voodoo witch doctor stereotype.
I mean, it ought to be no different from the Hitcher, but it is. There have been so many caricatures and racist portrayals of that archetype that it's not quite the same thing as a character directly based on Ron Moody's Fagin.
It's also interesting that people mention Old Gregg, because he's basically a Rick James homage. He also gets his music from some otherworldly source. When you factor in Rudi and Spider doing the same, it does begin to feel weird.
The show is still funny, but it's worth at least acknowledging the problems are there. And that, hey, some people might be offended when you don black makeup for comic effect (no matter what the excuse).
Mmmm. It's time for me to get inside you boy.
Someone noted that everyone on this thread who have criticized this as "racist" or "blackface" are all Americans. I would also wager that not a single one of them is black. In my experience, nobody gets their panties in a bunch over things that could possibly be interpreted as racist as middle class white people.
Just sayin'
Oh no, you do not mess with the Boosh! If you haven't seen the show, then I suggest you watch it. Most of the episodes feature a fantastical spirit/magical character whose face is painted and wears strange clothing.
I see the Spirit of Jazz character more like a take on Baron Samedi, who is a Voodoo spirit, not a black person. How is it racist for a white person to dress like a God/spirit? The accent is thicker on this character, but both the white characters in this skit try to imitate a New Orleans accent as well.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baron_Samedi
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loa
PS I'm an American
Someone noted that everyone on this thread who have criticized this as "racist" or "blackface" are all Americans. I would also wager that not a single one of them is black. In my experience, nobody gets their panties in a bunch over things that could possibly be interpreted as racist as middle class white people.
Just sayin'
This kind of defensive rant's usually put forth by the kind of person who has some issues with race.
Just sayin'.
I would also be aware that some people might mistake the get-up for a mistral costume, but I don't think that means the outfit is inherently offensive (or that you shouldn't do it). The character is made to look like he's made of bones. He's a ghost or a spirit. That's why he's black and white.
The dreads are a bit odd, I'll admit, especially because they don't have anything to do with jazz... I'm from New Orleans, and blew that off as British people being confused about things relating to black culture.
The dialect of the character, "I is the spirit of jazz", is African-American Vernacular English, but that is what the great American jazz musicians spoke! I take offense at anyone who says that that way of speaking is offensive! We all speak in different ways. The Asian "Engrish" example above isn't parallel to AAVE. AAVE isn't ungrammatical English... it's a fully regularized, culturally significant, full-fledged dialect of English with obvious relevance to the history of jazz.
So... I say, go with the costume. But be prepared to explain yourself. People are sensitive, and I don't blame them. These issues are touchy.
On that subject, one year I dressed up with my brother as an iPod add... we dressed all in black with black gloves and wigs and makeups and carried fake white iPods and danced in front of a large colorful sheet of foamcore... and we were mistaken for being in blackface and scowled at when our "colorful background" friend walked away. People are sensitive, and rightfully so. No one was mad at us once we pointed to our colorful background and explained.
Neon Tooth, constantly implying that everyone that disagrees with you is a secret racist is not the same as making a convincing argument.
This is no more racist blackface as the Moon character is racist whiteface.
What part of my comment constituted a "rant"? All I'm saying is that the outrage in this thread is a fairly typical guilty white kneejerk response to something that the supposed offended group wouldn't even care about. Maybe I'm wrong, maybe black people actually would be offended by this. But I doubt it.
I just say one more thing. The accent IS offensive. For those of you who are not familiar with the many geographical differences in the southern accent, you may not have noticed-- and the Boosh probably have no idea-- but the accent portrayed is that of a southern plantation slave.
Black New Orleanians DO NOT talk like that. They speak in what is called the "Yat" dialect.
http://www.slate.com/id/2125901/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yat_dialect
his hats not on fire...
I thought about doing this costume for Halloween as well and debated over the Blackface issue, because I like the show and thought it was a funny episode. Ultimately I decided against it. It doesn't matter if the intention is not racist, America has a bad history of minstrel performances and there has got to be sensitivity to that context. It would be like wearing a swastika and referencing it as a sanskrit symbol. Maybe in some context its arguable, but you'd be an idiot not to expect someone to associate it with Nazi Germany.
I think that what may seem like a "trend" of Americans having "knee-jerk" reactions to stuff like this is actually just a result of more and more Americans realizing that this sort of thing is in fact offensive to a lot of people. (and of course, some people jump on that bandwagon and call foul even though they don't really understand the issue, simply because they don't want to be on the wrong side of the racism fence)
the issue is complicated, and as a culture we don't fully have a grasp on it - because we haven't spent enough time discussing it.
I do think that this costume is a bit offensive, but not in a "how dare you! what is wrong with you?" sort of way that for example, a costume referencing the holocaust of slavery would. I don't think it was meant to offend (obviously) but i think it does display a lack of understanding on the issue.
would you find a costume portraying a native American offensive, even if it didn't emphasize what you see as any negative stereotypes?
what about dressing up as an Orthodox Jew or as an Amish person (given that the person in the costume did not identify with either of those groups)
why or why not?
I find The Spirit of Jazz completely non-offensive. A black guy myself, I love The Spirit of Jazz, and I really see him as just that; the spirit of jazz, with a Mighty Boosh twist. I'm fully educated about the ignorant things that were done in the past, and I've encountered blackface minstrelty even in my life time. This character wasn't supposed to do the same thig as blackface. It was done to create a character, and a funny one at that. I even want to be him for Halloween. I don't think the big race deal is necessary right now, and I think people would be able to agree with me if they actually watched the *fantastic* show, and put it in that context.
"Why assume that because the U.S. commenters bring up blackface is because the U.S. is overly sensitive and too P.C.? Might it also indicate a long and painful history re: racism and an overwhelming desire to move beyond it?"
But I didn't say "the US is overly sensitive and too P.C.", which is what you chose to base the rest of your comment on, so none of it is really relevant to anything I was saying.
I said that there is a tendency for the US-at-large to label anyone not-black with dark-coloured facepaint on (in any context) blackface, and then to deem it racist. Maybe not you, but it is certainly "a trend" as I first described it, and yes, your history is a pretty good indicator.
Of course I understand why actual blackface is offensive (to some, as it should be to all), especially the US and UK, but again context is king. A swastika may be offensive tattooed on a white man's forehead, but not at all on a Hindu temple.
Again, I think there is a lot of interesting conversation to be had about what is being referenced in this character, and what they intended to convey with the symbols they are using, and where they failed miserably. But to see this post, comment "blackface", and discontinue the conversation is just not good enough for me.