What Became of Neanderthals? We Ate 'em, Made 'em into Jewelry, Says Scientist
How Neanderthals met a grisly fate: devoured by humans (Guardian UK, photo via Wikipedia)
The controversial suggestion follows publication of a study in the Journal of Anthropological Sciences about a Neanderthal jawbone apparently butchered by modern humans. Now the leader of the research team says he believes the flesh had been eaten by humans, while its teeth may have been used to make a necklace.
Fernando Rozzi, of Paris's Centre National de la Récherche Scientifique, said the jawbone had probably been cut into to remove flesh, including the tongue. Crucially, the butchery was similar to that used by humans to cut up deer carcass in the early Stone Age.
"Neanderthals met a violent end at our hands and in some cases we ate them," Rozzi said.
The idea will provoke considerable opposition from scientists who believe Neanderthals disappeared for reasons that did not involve violence.
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The disappearance of Neanderthals isn't that great a mystery. Just extrapolate from these few facts:
Humans are xenophobic (will kill those not like themselves)
Humans will eat anything
Humans breed like rabbits
Humans are jerks
and
Humans with a big dose of all of the 4 above would generally out-survive anyone with less.
Reminds me of Mr. Shows take on the 2000 year old man, the 2000 pound old man..
when asked if he had met Napoleon he replied,
"Met him? I et him."
How do we know they weren't butchered and eaten by other Neanderthals?
The question isn't what became of them, it's what will become of them:
http://escapepod.org/2009/05/07/episode-198-n-words/
I kind of wish Neanderthals were still around. What would happen? Would we fight them? Make them do manual labor? Put them in zoos? Be friends with them?
All of the above I suspect, GauchoAmigo.
Even if we ate some Neanderthals back in the day, though, it's by no means certain that we're responsible for their extinction. It could have been the climate change associated with the end of the Ice Age combined with the competitive pressure from H. sapiens that were the deciding factors.
I think if Neanderthals were still around we'd force them to sell car insurance.
PS. Om nom nom nom nom!
Two things... First, I'd like to know definitively whether the marks were made pre or post-mortem. There are documented examples all over the world of burial practices that involve dismembering the dead as part of rituals--I can think of the Celts off the top of my head as one example. There's evidence that Neanderthals had somewhat elaborate ritual burials for their dead, so it's not unlikely that they might have done post-mortem dismemberment burials.
Secondly, generalizing an entire population's demise from a single specimen is extremely unscientific. Even if it can be proven that this particular specimen was cannibalized (by whom? humans? other neanderthals?) it doesn't mean that Neanderthals died out because they were cannibalized.
And of course, all of this is predicated upon the still-unproven idea that humans and neanderthals were separate species, incapable of interbreeding.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gSWjkYAjAzA
This is essentially the same conclusion as in the article in the October 2008 issue of National Geographic Magazine.
And of course, all of this is predicated upon the still-unproven idea that humans and neanderthals were separate species, incapable of interbreeding.
Why would that make any difference in the question of whether modern humans killed them off or not?
@11: who wouldn't go a little hungry for some caveman strange?
#11 If humans and neanderthals are the same species, then we're not talking about extinction, or even disappearance. It's just humans and more humans.
@ #13 posted by whenelvisdied:
#11 If humans and neanderthals are the same species, then we're not talking about extinction, or even disappearance. It's just humans and more humans.
In any case we're talking about an ethnically distinct subgroup of humans that were completely wiped out. We know they were here thousands of years ago and we know they were physiologically very different than any humans alive today.
The mystery of what happened to the Neanderthals is equally intriguing whether or not they did the nasty with our ancestors. (As of now there is no genetic evidence that they did).
There's good eatin' on a Neanderthal.
OMFG, so we ate their livers with some fava beans and a nice chianti?!11!
Remember the WWII stories of some American combat troops in the Pacific collecting Japanese gold teeth?
I remember a LIFE Magazine photo of a girl proudly displaying a Japanese soldier's skull that her boyfriend sent or brought home from the islands. I wonder if TIME, Inc. still has that in the archives?
If someone finds it, please don't post the link.
Buddy66 that reminds me of a description in the (fictional) collection of Vietnam war stories "The Things They Carried" (Tim O'brien) of a guy who had a necklace made out of Viet Cong ears.. they were described as looking like apricots. That mental image has stuck with me for the seven years since I've read that book. What is it with people and necro-trophies?
when you've been on the edge of life and death and survived by luck or will, you either bury the memory or control it with tangibles like trophies or legion membership.
Except that the vast majority of neanderthal remains found to date don't show signs of violent deaths or cannibalism. Creating a whole new theory of Neanderthal extinction from a single fossil is sloppy science.
Pacific War ear necklaces were not uncommon, I am told. Gold teeth are harder to come by. It is my hunch that the degree of such collecting is related to the degree of racial contempt in which the defeated enemy is held. I know of no such necrophile practices by American soldiers in WWII Europe. Germans apparently got to keep their nice white ears.
All of the ancient human fossils we have collected over the centuries can fit in the back of a pick-up truck, or something like that. The extrapolation skills at work here are astounding.
The story that sounds most likely to me is competition. Neanderthals were simply less versatile than humans for two reasons:
1. Their heavy skeleton made it hard or impossible for them to swim, thus limiting their mobility and choice of food sources.
2. Their shoulder and elbow construction meant that they were much stronger than humans, but they could not throw very effectively or possibly not at all.
I don't think it's unlikely that a little cannibalism occurred, as we know that humans are omnivorous and have practised cannibalism up throughout history and thus probably would not flinch at eating Neanderthals.
Whether this was a significant factor in pushing Neanderthals over the edge is, I believe, impossible to say based on one single find.
It's a very interesting discovery nonetheless.
"Soylent green is PEOPLE!"
""
"OH, carry on then."
And yes, what other have said. We could come up with all sorts of speculations. Maybe they died off from all the Kuru.
FWIW, this wouldn't be cannibalism as cannibalism is eating your own kind.
Xeni's PCP post on the other hand....
I'm not convinced that Neanderthals were completely wiped out. I think the two species were able to breed and produce fertile offspring (non-hybrids). The recent discovery of the FOXP2 gene in a Neanderthal tooth may shed some light on that theory. That gene is thought to be responsible for language in humans and may have swept through the species 50,000 years ago. Roughly the same time humans encountered neanderthals in Europe.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2007/10/19/MNM6SS9C6.DTL&type=science
There has been speculation that the Basques are Europe's oldest population and may retain the most genetic characteristics of early human-neanderthal unions. There language is unrelated to any other on earth. They have the highest incidence of Rh Negative factor and type-O blood (thought to be the oldest) in the world. Conveniently they have also lived for time immemorial in the same area where the last traces of the Neanderthals have been found.
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Is there ANY chance this could happen to the Republicans?
OK, how 'bout just Glen Beck?
Yeah. I know. Nobody's THAT hungry.
Wait, can you make giant carnivorous apes out of stem cells?
No wonder they're against them...
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Basing an extinction theory on a single archeological find may be sloppy science, but it is an easy and cheap way to get your name and your university's name in the world press, and even on boingboing!
I heard about this in the newspaper in France
btw:
Centre National de la Recherche. Thats how is writen
Pretty creepy...
TLC (tastes like chikin')
Centre National de la Recherche. Thats how is writen
Pretty creepy...
Creepy? How is "National Research Centre" creepy?
Is it more or less creepy than, for example, "National Aeronautics and Space Administration"?
Or "Communications Network Riser"?