Ex-Marine on Information Technology in Iraq
Tyler Boudreau, who served in the Marine Corps infantry for more than a decade, wrote a fascinating personal story for Industry Standard about digital technology on the battlefield. It's an interesting story about how IT can get in the way of human initiative and common sense. Boudreau's book, Packing Inferno: The Unmaking of a Marine, will be published in September by Feral House. From the article:
Article: I.T. vs. Initiative, Buy Packing Inferno: The Unmaking of a MarineUnfortunately, high-speed communications and bold initiative do not always go hand in hand. With such an abundance of information available simultaneously at all levels, micromanagement can creep unnoticed into the chain of command and pull it apart. For example, if a general is able to follow an ongoing firefight through email and IM, and he is inclined to believe he knows what's best for the units in contact, then he very well might start directing those small units from afar, consequently eliminating the need for his colonels, captains, and sergeants to do any thinking of their own.
I witnessed this firsthand in al Anbar.
the latest
latest episodes
I tried to find the dilbert cartoon where the pointy-haired boss is micromanaging Dilbert to the point of telling him how to move his mouse. He ends shouting something like "You fool!" at Dilbert.
Couldn't find it. Pretend you're looking at it now.
so, how has anything changed since All Quiet on the Western Front?
I've been told by former Marines that guys who used to be in the Marines and aren't any more prefer to be called "former Marines."
They explained it like this: a former Marine is just a guy who used to be in the Marines. An Ex-Marine is a guy who used to be in the Marines and is a psycho.
It's basically because 'ex-Marine' has become such a byword for 'nutjob' that they feel like they're threatening people when they say it, so they say "former Marine."
I, for one, am inclined to respect their wishes. After all, who knows what they might do! :-)
Looks like one to put in the queue.
In the Book World War Z there is a scene where the soldiers due to the too much information could see the tens of thousands of zombies attacking them in their positions and many in the story freaked out and lost heart.
I suppose for the boots on the ground that there is something to be said for being kept in the dark and worrying only about what is in front of you.
One of the points made in Black Hawk Down was that there was a commo disconnect between the intel and and the troops because they had to relay through a command chopper flying overhead. In that case the information got to them too late and caused lots of problems.
There is a happy medium where you use tech as a tool to help accomplish the task. Tech should not be the task
There is also the "Once a Marine, always a Marine" aspect to it. They really do prefer to be called former, and not ex-, Marines.
yes, as a former Marine myself, you are taught early on to use the phrase "former" in lieu of "ex".
i cringe when someone calls me an ex-marine. its the same as someone who hasnt served in the Marine Corps calling me a jarhead.
One of the points made in Black Hawk Down was that there was a commo disconnect
And intel disconnect, and political disconnect, and logistics disconnect, and, and...
#7 Aye, but I was trying to stay on topic
Well, they micromanaged in Vietnam and they didn't have instantaneous comms back then.
The only people that truly need the intel are the ones with their boots on the ground and their lives on the line.
You don't call the General asking for intel, you call your Lieutenant, you follow the chain of command and insist that it be followed by your superiors. If they can't handle that then I guess they'll have to cancel everyones birthday party. What else can they do to you?
they can bomb you
The root of the problem isn't technology, it's using technology to replace skills and training rather than to supplement them. Computers and fancy sensors and communication equipment should help enable people to do the things they are trained to do; it shouldn't replace that training.
I've always wondered why it is that if we (we being the U.S.) have the best weapons and war tech, why do we need so much more of it than everyone else? Shouldn't our fancy gadgets let us be more efficient? I may have to grab a copy of this one and see if there's a possible answer.
"why do we need so much more of it"
because someone is making a LOT of money
ah the eternal military dichotomy: those on the top, no matter what they might say, want a horde of obedient, expendable, mindless kill-bots, those on the bottom want enough information and autonomy to survive. Silly really.
the eternal military dichotomy: those on the top
That would be generals.
want a horde of obedient, expendable, mindless kill-bots
(shakes head)
I can only assume that you divined this using your powers of remote mind reading.
no greg, generals don't run things. do they?
Honestly, Takuan, when I was in the Army they went out of their way in basic to remind us that initiative at the sharp end was a GOOD thing, a thing that set us apart from other armies. Kill bots (as much as I may personally love them and eagerly await their inevitable world domination) weren't what they wanted.
The idea of politicians and military brass using the troops as cannon fodder is not exactly novel. And we're pretty close to having actual kill-bots, which will cost so much to manufacture, they'll be less expendable than the humans that they replace.
Tell me, what's the survival rate of "the sharp end"?
Apologies for browser ineptitude.
But just think, Antinous: economies of scale! Soon killbots will be cheap and plentiful!
anyone ever count how many top brass committed suicide after Viet Nam?
The sharp end often has a low survival rate. Sometimes, even after wars. That isn't what I was arguing against, though. I was really only responding to your post #14; my experience suggests that generals generally don't want mindless obedience. Pun intended.
they sure as hell don't want discussion and thoughtful review of why everyone is trying to kill each other either. The bottom line is that they only value the careerists and lifers. Everyone else just doesn't count.
#1 - I think its more correct to refer to him as the "pointy-hair boss".
Takuan! Recover your cold-blooded detachment from the foibles of humankind AT ONCE! This cynicism ill-becomes you.
woof woof
cyn·ic Audio Help /ˈsɪnɪk/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[sin-ik] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun
1. a person who believes that only selfishness motivates human actions and who disbelieves in or minimizes selfless acts or disinterested points of view.
2. (initial capital letter) one of a sect of Greek philosophers, 4th century b.c., who advocated the doctrines that virtue is the only good, that the essence of virtue is self-control, and that surrender to any external influence is beneath human dignity.
3. a person who shows or expresses a bitterly or sneeringly cynical attitude.
–adjective
4. cynical.
5. (initial capital letter) Also, Cynical. of or pertaining to the Cynics or their doctrines.
6. Medicine/Medical Now Rare. resembling the actions of a snarling dog.
[Origin: 1540–50;
—Synonyms 1, 3. skeptic, pessimist, misanthrope.
I read just a few months ago, a terrific history of the Korean War, and was impressed by many examples of both the sort of officer you seem to think exists without exception, and the sort, at all levels of command, that does in fact reward careful thought and consideration among his staff, and who listens, often in person, to the men at the front. They do exist. I've met some.
Interesting post, however it doesn't seem to be a technology issue, but a management issue. The military isn't the only organization that can be inundated with information and manage it incorrectly.
That said, thanks to this Marine for his service and bravery!
I, for one, welcome our new kill-bot overlords.
Now can you get all these copies of Grace Park to leave me alone?
http://www.boingboing.net/2008/06/11/sabotage-manual-from.html
Eustace@27:They do exist. I've met some.
actual, living, breathing, examples to the contrary do in no way render null or void any blanket statements by Takuan.
Because it's "no matter what they might say". And it's no matter what you might say. And it's no matter what anyone else might say.
finally I have a groupie; I'm flattered.
This kind of thinking can be observed on many of the video clip websites that post gun-camera films from the middle east. You can hear the gunner talking to someone who passes it up and up and it all works its way down (about that fast) in real time to authorize shootings or bombings.
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=be7_1214484454
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=354_1212510486
In world war II they called this "playing checkers with subs." When they gave sub commanders more autonomy they started living longer and sinking more tonnage.
up until they captured Enigma
nah, the real pivotal event was when Thule-Gesellschaft sorcerers offended Poseidon. His vengeance is terrible.
stupid Nazis
Too bad I wasn't in a position to deal with those clowns. Would have sold them Mjolnir, The Spear of Destiny, Brunhilda's brass bra and a whole lot of dwarf bread.
Takuan, the gods could get really angry at you. In fact, if you sold them Mjolnir, they'd be really Thor at you.
"You didn't!"
"Odin't I? Yes, I'm a Freyad I did. Dry your Tyrs and stop tearing out your hair, or you'll be even Baldur."
LOL!