John McCain, credit-card debt victim
Responding to the news that John McCain and his wife owe AmEx $500,000 (presumably spent on the campaign trail), Jon Taplin writes,
I know what American Express charges for interest on a Platinum Card. A fiscally responsible household should probably sell some of the million of Anheuser-Busch stock they own and stop paying that 17% ARP on $500,000 worth of Amex charges. There are some other stark contrasts between the McCains and the Obamas. The McCains have a net worth around $40 million, almost all of it from Cindy’s holdings. The Obamas' net worth is closer to $4 million, most of it earned from Barack’s two recent books. Instead of going into debt they have managed to put $250,000 in a college savings account for their two daughters.Link
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Actually, there's something more gross about this story:
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If I reach his age I will likely stop paying off any cards and run up as much debt as possible enjoying myself to the fullest so they can make a futile attempt to collect from my non-existent heirs.
Hmm. Why am I paying 16% to AMEX when my FICO is over 800? Oh, yeah. I don't have a posse of lobbyists. My bad.
The recent documentary Maxed Out makes the claim that FICO has a special, separate database for the credit reports of people like politicians and famous actors, so that their credit reports are accurate and they're not prompted to complain or start getting all activist about problems with the credit reporting system. That sounds a bit like a paranoid conspiracy theory, but it also sounds like a profitable decision for FICO. I haven't seen the claim either verified or debunked. Anyone?
What slgalt points might be even grosser.
Yeah but the kicker is going to be when she claims to have been traveling with her husband so she could do some business for the company, then she writes the entire amount off on her taxes.
Why would AmEx offer a 0% interest rate to anyone, much less someone running up a half-million dollar tab?
welcome home Sister!
Where the hell have you been, young lady? We were about to send out a rescue party.
El Mariachi -- The answer is obvious if you rephrase the question: Why would a large company do a favor for a powerful politician?
patriotic duty?
So, a Plat card is a CHARGE card, not a credit card. Technically there is never an interest rate. I have a Platinum Amex as well, you can defer select charges interest free.
Amex makes their money off the merchants and a yearly fee.
So, a Plat card is a CHARGE card, not a credit card.
Amex offers many different kinds of cards, some available in platinum, of which only one is a charge card rather than a credit card. I pay interest on my platinum Optima, which is definitely an Amex card.
Actually, if you really really really want to paint McCain as a fiscally whatever ne'er-do...whatever... you'd point out that paying 17% interest on a half-mil here and there when you could just as easily take 20 minutes and pay it off is actually the smart move, for a man of his (and his wife's) preposterous means.
What's 17% APR on a tiny fraction of a multi-deka-million fortune such as McCain-and-wife possess? Answer: in all seriousness, it's not worth the effort it takes to ring the bell to summon the butler to call the finances guy to avoid paying it. If McCain were paying 1,000% APR on that half-mil, he'd still have enough to buy all the food and shelter and services and entertainment and prescription drugs he needed to live a very comfortable life until a natural death decades hence.
Meanwhile, why should McCain trouble his beautiful mind with what, to him, is less than a dollar a year would be to you and me?
Everyone knows that some pigs are more equal than others. So wadda ya complainin' 'bout?
Anyways, maybe Sister Y has, you know, a life? I should get one of those. I hear they're great.
Somebody calculated that Bill Gates would lose money if he stopped to pick up a $20 bill on the street because he makes more than that in the few seconds that it would take to pick it up.
Sure 500k is a lot of money, but as a percentage of assets it is not much. 500k/40M = 1.25% For me it would be like carrying 5k on my credit card, but I don't get a 0% interest rate, at 0% it is free money and they should hold the balance as long as possible, not factoring in political favours.
Antinous, why would Bill Gates stop making money during the time he took to pick up the $20? Not like he makes his money-per-second by actually doing anything.
So if you want to call into question how fiscally responsible John McCain is, I'd just like to point out that the McCain's owe only 1.25% of their net worth to a credit card, I wish I had that problem...
He runs the whole Microsoft empire from his brain implant. Duh.
I don't care how McCain or Obama spend their own money. I do care how they spend MY money.
He runs the whole Microsoft empire from his brain implant.
So his implant only works while he is standing upright? Hmmm, very interesting...
The reports of my having a life are greatly exaggerated.
the UnDead have to stick together
As Antinous said above, there's a difference between a Platinum/Gold/Green/Centurion charge card which you're supposed to pay off monthly and there are severe penalties if you don't (unless Amex really likes you as a customer) and any number of platinum Amex-branded credit cards, which function the same as other credit cards, such as visa or mastercard, where they want you to carry a balance as there's an interest charge on it...
Oftentimes you can get a lower rate by calling up your credit card issuer and saying, "Hi, I've been a customer for a while and I was wondering if you could lower my rate."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PnOLKA2FBXI
It might not always happen but it's worth a shot. I got mine lowered from about 18% to about 9% just by asking.
I'm not going to worry about millionaires and their debts, but I hope people don't want this guy shaping economic policy.
What logic was used to decide that money spent on a card with only Mrs. McCain's name on it would be 'presumably' used for campaigning? Was it the same logic (used by Jon Taplin) that decided to use the maximum possible debt 500k whereas the new york times only notes that the minimum could be 225k?
can we use the same logic to say that the Obama's have spent 3 million (the money they didn't save) on the campaign while McCain (who the nyt notes donates his salary to charity) only spent 500k?
LOOK!! NUMBERS!!! LETS SHOW OUR BIAS!
I have a 0% credit card and I'm a regular person... it is good until next spring and them I'm going to roll it over to another 0% credit card. No big deal.
bias? I do not understand. McBush represents the apocalypse, Obama a slim tendril of hope. Where is there bias?
What? No bias here. Obama, a self-made millionaire, is an elitist, while McSame, a trophy husband, gets a pass.
It amuses me to no end that the networks think they can still push this line, after all the bullsh*t they put us through for the past seven years. The "detected" liberal bias of the media is a fabrication, and only an idiot would vote for John McCain given his record.
Now, if only Kucinich had any interest in being VP...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnb2IrsU1Cg
The McCains have a net worth around $40 million, almost all of it from Cindy’s holdings.
Wow, I guess we all know who wears the tight glossy black leather dominatrix hot pants in THAT family.
For all we know, "$indy" might be force feeding her handcuffed hubby "McCan't" doggie kibble in their basement obedience chamber...
"Instead of going into debt they have managed to put $250,000 in a college savings account for their two daughters.
That's because they suckered millions into contributing to their campaign. Whether you like it or not, Presidential campaign spending caps are something that the U.S. has needed for a long time.
Two thoughts on this news-
1. Does this balance the two Democratic Senators who we've discovered have gotten marvelous 'deals' on their home mortgages that aren't available to the rest of us? Senators Conrad and Dodd must be hoping that news of AmEx's little 'understanding' with the McCain family pushes them off the Political pages (not that Faux News will drop it unless the RNC tells them to!).
2. These cards are in Cindy McCain's name? Just to confirm ,s this the same Cindy McCain that Senator McCain called a cunt during the 1992 campaign? I guess she must want this election as much as he does. The phrase that comes to mind is "She wouldn't say 'shit' if her mouth was full of it". I guess she must okay with it- hope she's never disfigured like first Mrs. McCain.
That's because they suckered millions into contributing to their campaign.
And how did they do that? By pretending to run for the nomination? If that's acting, bring this guy an Oscar.
("What part of 'di di mau don't you understand?" -- Sindy)
@takuan
The bias would be taking 'facts' and then (seemingly) skewing the crap out of them to show good on one side and bad on the other. When you say McCain is the apocalypse and Obama is a tendril of hope I don't see a negative bias, as it would appear that you think every things going to shit (even though it's not) and maybe, just maybe, Obama could pull us out while McCain definitely can't (the important part being that you're not citing references and then skewing them, you're just going by your gut)
@takeshi
Obama has become a 'self made millionaire' through politics, which makes him just as much of an untrustworthy ass clown as any other person who's in politics (why do people forget, every bloody election cycle, that we're voting for the lesser of two evils?!).
Obama being called an 'elitist' in the media is because he wasn't pandering to middle America during his time spent against Hillary, he was instead going for college aged kids and wealthy liberals (and it worked, so good on'em!) and one bad quote where he made an assumption (never assume because it makes an ass out of you and me) as to why hick town USA was bitter... where as McCain hasn't made any assumptions that notably pissed anyone off (if he has please let me know, because I'm really interested in understanding how him having a rich wife is detrimental to his character)
As for McCain's record: Obama doesn't have one. (OH SNAP!)
And just to note: I'll be voting Obama because he's the lesser of two evils (but I won't be surprised if he makes a choice I don't agree with, and if things don't get better I won't be forced to defend his worthless actions... I'll be able to sit and sigh.).
El Mariachi, because AmEx makes plenty of money from transaction fees (more than other credit cards) and interest is just a bonus. It's quite normal for businesses to extend nice terms to big customers, as long as they tend to pay eventually. Finally, AmEx charge cards have no interest rate and must be paid off monthly (well, they do have an insane penalty rate if you don't, and they harrass you a lot). So it's possible that Mrs. McCain charged $500k in that month and will have it paid off next month.
(And if you think that's obscene, I hear the AmEx Black is reserved only for customers that spend over $1 million per year)
Wow, a Republican displaying fiscal irresponsibility!
Imagine that !!!??
Spending money foolishly, hand-over-fist, while receiving preferential treatment from a corporate giant seems to attract the GOP like moths to a flame.
Unfortunately the burning material providing the heat is our national stability and the welfare of the (dwindling ) middle class.
John McCain, just another product of the short-sighted, privileged class that has run our country to ruin for the last 8 years.
Want more?
Vote GOP this fall.
###
If anything, this proves against conspiracy theories that the GOP is a front for a fascist world bank new world order. No soldier of the illuminati would have credit card debt.
why choose the lesser evil?
http://www.cthulhu.org/
Tak-kun,
You know the rule about putting your personal website in your comments. Red, white and blue aren't really your colors, anyway.
ummmm, the "evil" excuse OK?
http://lolthulhu.com/
check out the "not teh best selling beanie baby"
Oh, and I was going to sleep this year.
Whts th bg dl..H s wrth 40 mlln,nd h ws hlf mlln..m thts nly 1/80th f hs nt wrth.Y ppl r jst lkng fr ny rsn t ht n McCn.
Kp mrchng twrd tht clff...
No, the cliff's back there, bud. At this point most of us would be happy to find the ripcord.
While I have a distinct dislike of McCain, these sorts of arguments and accusations simply make no sense, and are a disservice to those who are making appropriate and well-reasoned arguments against him.
We've been in a similar situations, to a lesser extent, except with actual interest: I believe the sum of our credit card balances was probably around $60,000 to $80,000. However, we were quite busy, and it simply wasn't worth it for us to go through all of the necessary steps to get enough cash to pay off the debts in addition to our monthly expenses, for what would at the very most have saved us around $25,000. A year or so later, when some other investments were being sold for other reasons, we simply used part of those proceeds. Cash flow is not necessarily simple for some families, and there can be all sorts of complexities that can make it hard to actually pay off debt, even when an uninformed observer would think the debts absurd and easily repaid. Note that we were never even close to being actually insolvent during this, and I certainly don't think the McCains are now.
In this case, I see no reason why a $500,000 balance is at all extraordinary; I also fail to see how Obama's plans for college savings are at all relevant, or why anyone should be surprised that Obama, an widely-noted author with a best-selling book, makes more from royalties than McCain, who appears to only have nominal authorship of a handful of relatively obscure ghost-written books. There are enough serious problems with McCain; we don't need to contrive unconvincing artificial ones.
"Victim" is not the right word.
I don't see a victim here either, unless it is AmEx, and I doubt that.
No one worth $40 million manages their own money unless they are very sharp or a fool. Paying off a large debt early that you are paying little or no interest on with cash that is making money elsewhere would be foolish.
In fact, even if they have an AmEx charge card with normal terms, putting every expense possible on it so they get the free float (plus miles) is a smart thing. Especially if they know they will be able to pay it off every month and incur no fees. The cash they could have used to pay for expenses is making interest or investment income elsewhere.
Whatever their deal with AmEx is, if their credit card debt is that small a percentage of their net worth, it isn't a big deal. I don't like the man's politics, but I can't get worked up about this.
America is the land of debt--I mean, the land of freedom!
Ten years ago, I had a friend who worked for American Express's high-end accounts group. She told me back then, that it was common for those clients to spend over $100,000 per month on their cards because they used the card to refuel their jet, to pay for hotel bills for their entourage, and etc.
If $100K/month was common ten years ago, then $200K/month is probably pretty common today.
That suggests that the McCain's aren't victims of credit card debt. They're just people who live high on the hog... dramatically different lives from the rest of us.
Ahh, and of course we all realize two things:
First and most obvious:
We as tax payers will be paying off this wonderful tab of his should he reach office (I'm sure that his representative state is doing so thus far)
And two:
"The Obamas' net worth is closer to $4 million, most of it earned from Barack’s two recent books. Instead of going into debt they have managed to put $250,000 in a college savings account for their two daughters."
Doesn't this simply scream responsability? Why is there still question of whether or not this man can win the presidential election on his own volition?
I hope everyone understands that the political bimbos either launder their contributions through "book sales" ie donors buying and then shredding pallets of the worthless books or marry a sugar momma/daddy who can further their own agenda through their pwned boy/girl with their trust fund riches. The system doesn't work anymore except for money/power sluts or billionaires.
It should also be noted that almost all of Obama's wealth has come from his books which have had huge (free) promotion while he has been running for public office.
1. Write "memoir"
2. Run for public office
3...
4. PROFIT!
"don't understand how these things work"
ahem: rich people get to do what they want because other rich people help them. Poor people don't.
#60
ahem: rich people get to do what they want because other rich people help them. Poor people don't.
Poor people do it too. But when we do it they either call it gang activity or a riot. :)
@ Spoon:
Oh, you devil. You didn't! Obama doesn't have a record? Ha! I almost get it. Listen and listen good. As a political lender, I'd far prefer someone with no credit or slow credit to someone with HORRENDOUS credit.
Obama doesn't strike me as evil in the least, whatever you may think you know about him. Yes, perhaps it is true that he made his money from politics. Nothing inherently evil there. Nor is there anything particularly evil about wanting to get us away from Iraq or Bush's failed economic "policy." Lesser of two evils is a bit of an understatement, frankly.
But just so we are both aware, I refuse to debate politics with someone who uses cliches like "never assume because it makes an ass out of you and me." Wasn't that used in The Burbs or something?
http://abcnews.go.com/Business/story?id=5058692
Happy Monday. When I get to the office, this thread is going to become a lot shorter.
Fleesa: "It's time to start paying!"
"Poor people do it too. But when we do it they either call it gang activity or a riot. :)"
You made spill my coffee, Jamie Sue.
And so continues the Boing Boing-Obama love fest. All hail Jesus Christ Obama who will save us all.
To #3, if you've got a credit score north of 800, what the hell are you doing paying 16% on a credit card for?
LOTS and LOTS of assumptions being made around here... hell, maybe he's charging campaign-related expenses to his personal card, getting reimbursed by the campaign, and getting money rebated to his grandkids' 529 accounts.
McBush's credit card really doesn't matter much. What does matter is the threat he presents to all humanity by trying to start a slow burning World War 3.
Americans seem to forget that the people in the Middle East who have suffered incredible hardship and atrocity due to the "choice" of Bush by the American people are also watching to see who will come next. If McBush ascends to imperial power next, it will be a signal that there can be no hope of reconciliation or peace for muslims and brown people who happen to be living on oil fields. What would you do if you were in their shoes?
Regarding McCain's heavy use of American Express accounts, consider that there may be hidden benefits to him for doing that. When I worked in a high end store we would have customers come in every holiday season and pay for thousands or tens of thousands of dollars worth of merchandise with Amex Gift Checks. They got these certificates free as a rebate for using their accounts. many of these customers were business owners who used their Amex accounts to buy everything they possibly could. One told me that he spent over $1M/year on business outlays on the Amex so he could get the free Gift Checks. The kickback amounted to thousands of dollars back in his pocket.
how much is that in air miles?
What is it with these people? I made about 600 grand a couple of years ago and now have 630 grand in the bank and a mortgage paid off on my 350,000$ house. What do they do with their money?
run for office
"He has poisoned our water forever. Nixon will be remembered as a classic case of a smart man shitting in his own nest. But he also shit in our nests, and that was the crime that history will burn on his memory like a brand. By disgracing and degrading the Presidency of the United States, by fleeing the White House like a diseased cur, Richard Nixon broke the heart of the American Dream."
Hunter S Thompson
Not to be too snarky
Implicit in the notion of 'snark' is humor or cleverness, so you're not really being snarky at all. Are you upset at Ross for some reason?
Not to be too snarky, but if "ROSSINDETROIT" knows about these hidden benefits, I can only assume they are not really very well hidden I stated that poorly. Thank you for the opportunity to clarify. I was saying that there are reasons for some people to do much of their spending on AmEx that are not immediately obvious. Getting kickbacks in the form of Gift Checks to the tune of thousands of dollars is one reason a person might use the accounts heavily and have a substantial balance at any given time even if they pay it off on a monthly basis and incur no interest charges.