Smell of pot smoke not grounds for arrest and search in Canada
The Saskatchewan Court of Appeal upheld a lower court's ruling that the smell of burned marijuana is not enough to allow police to arrest someone and conduct a warrantless search.
"The smell alone can't constitute the grounds because the smell of burnt marijuana -- as opposed to raw marijuana -- gives an inference that the material is gone, it's dissipated into the atmosphere. So how can you say you're in possession of something that doesn't exist?" said Ronald Piche, Janvier's lawyer.Link"There may be suspicion that the person is in possession of marijuana but that's not enough to base an arrest."
The Crown appealed the decision and the trial judge's decision was upheld.
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Lawyers are conniving, wiggly little bastards. God bless them. God bless each and every one of them.
And so the tide turns. It is clear the consensus in Canada is to do what the Len in the Dain Commission Report of almost forty years ago recommended: decriminalize (if not legalize) marijuana. In spite of the flailing of the current Canadian care-taker government,more and more court decisions are coming down on the side of rationality.
I note also an encouraging civil rights sign in the recent dismissal of all charges and evidence in a grow operation bust. The judge tossed the case since the police immediately broke down the door instead of waiting a few moments after the first knock. While this particular case almost certainly benefited organized crime instead of a private person growing a few plants for own use, it set an import precedent protecting citizens basic rights: no military style search-assaults on suspicion alone.
I am sure the police are offended at this since they feel put at risk - but if you look at the numbers in Canada of police killed in raids versus innocents killed by police,they are still "winning".
In before treatise on law of conservation.
Speaking of combustion, I need to make a phone call.
While I don't always agree with the way defense attorneys get clients off the hook, when they make use decent logic like this I can get behind it and support it. Now if only they truly were altruistic people and fought the good fight to eliminate stupid laws altogether.
On the flip side I'm curious to know how long it will take for our government to try and paint Canada as an evil country for this. I was watching the pilot episode of "The A-team" last night (yeah I have issues lol) and the plot revolved around marijuana crops and their inherent evils. While watching I kept thinking about how much things have changed since the 1980's since most of the US marijuana crops actually originate in Canada now.
When will Stephen Harper be portrayed as the new millenium's Noriega?
Also when will Cory hop in here and give us another distorted taste of his antimarijuana viewpoints ala the "stoner pisses on dying woman" post?
This makes me wish I was a pot smoker. I suddenly get the feeling I could be getting away with something.
Too bad I can't stand the stuff...
"since most of the US marijuana crops actually originate in Canada now."
No.
Mexico.
Canada is a few percent. You have to watch that lying by government.
And Stephen Harper is George Bushes little nephew - if not clone.
Let us hope that the US will be influenced by Canada's more open-minded (in part) attitude toward the use of Cannabis, pot or weed, but never --Marijuana-- (US Fed code for No-Mexicans Allowed!). It one of God's plants and helps a lot of people.
It seems part of the argument is that possession of pot smoke in the lungs, or THC in the bloodstream is not considered possession of marijuana, and well, that's true. Just like wood is wood and wood smoke is not (I can't build a house out of smoke).
There is another argument here: how do you KNOW it's pot smoke you smell? My brother used to smoke these ridiculous ginseng cigarettes that occasionally smelled like pot.
I thought most pot in the US came from the US? Must just be in Ohio.. it grows wild here. At least that's what the soybean farmers claim when it's found mixed with trees in their windbreaks.
from the DEA website:
"Overall marijuana production in Mexico--the principal source of foreign-produced marijuana to U.S. drug markets appears to be increasing. Mexico marijuana production estimates indicate that production in Mexico was relatively low from 2000 through 2002 during a period of drought, increased sharply in 2003 as weather improved, and receded slightly in 2004 (see 2006 National Drug Threat Assessment, Table 5)."
It seems part of the argument is that possession of pot smoke in the lungs, or THC in the bloodstream is not considered possession of marijuana, and well, that's true. Just like wood is wood and wood smoke is not (I can't build a house out of smoke).
There is another argument here: how do you KNOW it's pot smoke you smell? My brother used to smoke these ridiculous ginseng cigarettes that occasionally smelled like pot.
That is retarded on so many levels. If you're going to make drugs illegal, then you should let the cops arrest people for using it.
If you smell some burnt marijuana, you can infer that they've probably got a bag of it and they're going to burn some more in a minute.
some of us prefer to live as free human beings
#8: You are right about the ginseng cigarettes. They smell almost exactly like pot.
Danegeld - that's a ridiculous inferance. If I have ketchup on my face and I'm out and wandering around, I've probably eaten my french fries.
More importantly, if I get stuck on the bus with some asshole who's smoking on the bus (illegally) and he has the bad taste to be smoking pot, I'm gonna smell like pot, as is everyone else on the bus. None of us are going to have pot on us, with the POSSIBLE exception of the smoker, assuming he doesn't finish his blunt before getting chased off the bus by irritated co-passengers.
Takuan, the quote you posted specifically says "the principal source of foreign-produced marijuana to U.S. drug markets" - implying to me that domestic production might (or, yes, might not) hold a larger share of the US market. Do you know if that's the case?
I do know that farming in the US could be made very profitable in short order.
No one is suggesting that open, public use be allowed, unless it's in a coffee shop. And as far as the Mexican comment goes, it's a historical reference to what occured in the US to make pot illegal. It was an anti-Mexican motivated peace of law. And is crap.
"That is retarded on so many levels. If you're going to make drugs illegal, then you should let the cops arrest people for using it."
You give up your privacy and rights all you want, it looks good on you! No one in their right mind is going to waste time chasing pot smokers, not in Canada anyway. Retarded in my books is having your phones tapped and your rights trampled, and not doing anything about it.
@16
Hawaii is huge, but a special case. The last figures I saw a year or so ago referred to Mexico as the biggest single source, period. The logistics are just easier there. It can be grown in outdoor fields and literally trucked across the border en masse.
Canada seems to produce boutique marijuana; high quality,consistent and high priced. It should be noted that the illegality of marijuana in the USA causes major social problems in Canada since guns and cocaine are frequently exchanged for pot. Many Canadian victims of gun crime can thank American prohibition of pot for their troubles. Similarily, many Canadian cocaine victims can thank the DEA and the Warondrugs Industry.
I'm so used to the Canadian varieties where I live I don't even think about the rest of it (yeah I'm a "pothead" network engineer. Beats drinking alcohol any day). I also suppose it's due to every cannabis user I know referring to bad quality, cheap crappy pot as "mexi".
On a totally other topic, if maximum security prisons have drug problems, and a lot of our drugs come via Mexico, why do we even waste so much money on the DEA. Silly me for thinking education is a logical alternative to incarceration.
#12 Welcome to the slippery slope. I saw you smoking a cigarette and then eating 2 candybars. Obviously you've got the munchies and now I can search you yes?
The DEA exists to serve the DEA. Try to do anything about it about it and something will happen to you.
#12 & #15
I agree with Danegeld, and i smoke.
It is a reasonable inference, having smelt weed smoke, that further investigation may be warrented (not that kind of warrented).
Its like saying, gunshots were heard but let's not investigate because the bullets were obviously already fired.. so no more bullets likely exist.
I don't want cops coming in my house, but as far as someone who actually believed in the law goes, I think is a fair inference to make.
'where there's smoke, there's fire' or 'where there's smoke, there's the potential to be more..'
Takuan, we can sign petitions to get medical cannabis laws enacted. We can try to de-criminalize it through peaceful demonstration. Are you suggesting that you'll be busted if you let it be known you're a big pot head?
*warranted :(
1. If I'm walking down the street, and happen to 'smell like sex', I must be strip-searched and possibly arrested for 'public nudity', 'lewd and laviscious behavior', 'patronizing a prostitute', etc. I mean, I'm OBVIOUSLY guilty, eh? Even though I've just walked out of my own apartment building after makin' sum whoopie wit my girl ....
2. If I'm walking down the street, and happen to have 'too much cologne', will I be busted for 'inciting a riot'? (yeah, I'm rather hunky ... LOL!)
3. If I'm walking down the street, and happen to 'smell like chocolate', will I be busted for 'suspicion of robbing a bakery'?
Or will the lady cop mistake the smell of chocolate for cologne, and give me a 'lick down'?? ROFL!
Jeff:
Read up about Marc Emery. A tireless campaigner for legalization and medical marijuana, he fearless jerked the DEA's beard when they leaned on Canada. For his trouble he was marked as a political opponent and sold out by a craven Canadian government. Watch Marc Emery http://www.cannabisculture.com/
I know all about him. He got shut down for one primary reason: The Canadian Government caved into presure from the USA, specifically the DEA.
Emery was a well-know seed distributor, and that's really what got him into trouble. It was quite fun there for a while when his site vanished. I have friends in low places. Hehehe
Most cops, at least in the larger cities in Canada, have already realized it's just silly to hassle everyone they suspect might have been smoking pot. I was sharing a joint with a circle of friends in an alley outside a bar and we suddenly realize that there is a police officer standing right behind us. IT was incredibly obvious what we were doing but the officer just kind of stepped into the circle, made fun of us for a minute and told us to go smoke somewhere else. I realize this doesn't hold true for every cop but I think most of them know it's a losing and pointless battle. It's more constructive to suggest we go somewhere more private than to search us, confiscate a couple grams of pot and haul us to the station while elsewhere a bunch of rowdy drunks are smashing a phone booth.
"Oh Canada, our home and native land, True patriot love... ummm. err..." What was I singing again?
I love living in Canada. After seeing the daily stupidity in the US regarding the "War on Drugs", It's nice to get a Unicorn Chaser of Canadian sensibility.
When are you Yanks going to have another revolution to take your country back?
There are problems in Canada
http://www.cannabisculture.com/noextradition/
Meanwhile, back on the reserve...
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/saskatchewan/story/2008/02/13/marijuana-saskatchewan.html
@30 re: there are problems in Canada,
True, true... but when you read the article;
"The United States Justice Department and DEA want Canada's government to extradite these three political activists to face 10 years up to life in US prison!"...yet they've never been to the US!
As in most of the world, this sh*t is all stirred up by the "War on Drugs" in the United States. And a Prime Minister that kisses the butt of that War Criminal, George Bush. And a Minister of Justice who loves the ideas of "War on Drugs" and "War on Terror"as a way of controlling the people.
Thank GOD we have some sensible judges who are interested in Canadian sovereignty and common sense.
O, Canada... Glorious & Free!
Canada is obviously afraid of what the US will do if they don't play along. Canada realizes that the US is the Top Dog, and if the DEA/border-customs wants to they can screw big time with all those trucks crossing the border, not to mention average folks. Saying NO to the USA can cost Canada billions, and they know it. So, why don't Canadians who are pro-pot, stop buying American goods?(maybe some have)They should stay away from Florida and California during the winter, don't come to Detroit to go shopping. STAY away.
Aint' gonna happen.
Marijuana is not a crime.
Phew. 'ere. And don't Bogart that joint.
"Retarded in my books is having your phones tapped and your rights trampled, and not doing anything about it."
Retarded is doing all that while letting people smoke pot in their trucks and refusing to search people who are obviously in possession of pot. For every 10 retarded cops, there's a least one retarded judge. This won't stand.
Half the cops I know are corrupt and the other half just haven't gotten there yet, but are well on their way. Some days I'm glad we have the police to call in case of an emergency, but other days I know that most cops are just criminals with uniforms and guns. It's one of --those-- days today.
Why is it we are not allowed to ingest dangerous poisons that will kill us? Surely evolution will take care of everything. Or do we not believe in evolution?