Hiroshima man keeps crocodilian pet
Japan Probe provides a translation of a Japanese news story about a man in Hiroshima who has pet spectacled caiman.
LinkMurabayashi got the caiman, which he creatively named Caiman, from a pet shop 23 years ago. Caiman was once small enough for Murabayashi’s daughter to carry, but has since grown to a length of 2 meters.
Caiman is used to living with humans and does not bite or attack them. Murabayashi’s daughter seems totally okay with sitting next to Caiman while holding her baby.
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Caiman is not "used to" living with humans. There is not enough brain there for such concepts as "used to". One day, a child will be eaten.
Caiman is not "used to" living with humans. There is not enough brain there for such concepts as "used to". One day, a child will be eaten.
This.
This is probably a case similar to a circus' animals. They are fine as long as they are fed and full.
Um, Matt? What does "this" mean to the rest of the english speakers here?
#5, it means "I whole-heartedly agree with this statement, and as such, wish to repeat it word-for-word, without adding any content of my own, for it's succinct brilliance is unsurpassed by any other comment made thus far."
Kind of easier to type "this," though.
Nasty creatures. Remember when Steve Irwin took his child into the crocodile pit, http://youtube.com/watch?v=Y8OyqxojZlw ; he said it was perfectly safe as well. Different strokes for different folks.
@#6: Mayhap it would be clearer and similarly succinct to post "I agree".
Ah, you may find broader comprehension with something like "Ditto" or "Me too".
The history of the domesitcation of animals has depended upon a few animals who genetically are less likely to be skittish around humans (this would explain why horses from central Asia were tamed, but not zebras, who have to contend with all manner of vicious predators and so are far more skittish). It is possible (just possible) that this caiman will remain comfortable around humans (again, as long as it's fed and not hurt); it might just be genetically less fearful.
@#10: thats interesting, but doesn't domestication generally take several generations? And even in domestication, you still have instances of dogs biting people, horses kicking, etc. But replace a dogs jaws with that of a 2 meter reptile and suddenly an accident equals amputation. Plus we are dealing with reptilian brain, not mammal. That makes a difference as well.
@ ILL LICH
Your post reminded about the Soviet study to domesticate silver foxes which I first read about in Richard Dawkins' The Ancestor's Tale: A Pilgrimage to the Dawn of Evolution. Though domesticating one caiman might prove difficult.
The character "Sonny" on Miami Vice used to have a pet alligator. The trainer for the animal said that alligators (or was it a croc ?) are never tame, they only seem that way and and are just waiting for the right moment to attack.
Caiman is used to living with humans and does not bite or attack them.
Change to:
Caiman is used to living with humans and has not bitten or attacked them.
You can't tame a reptile. Unless it's a dinosaur. And you're going to put a rack of missiles on it.
Joel Johnson's comment brought back memories of a delightful TV movie called The Enormous Egg that I saw too many years ago.
Read more of F Gwynplaine MacIntyre's commentary at imdb.com.
Sagan's "The Dragons of Eden" offers insight here.
Understand that the common popular culture of Japan vis a vis the human/animal relationship is not as one finds it in the West. Witness the incredible and persistent ongoing torture and murder of cetaceans.
Did anybody else start humming the Schnappi song when they saw this one?
Every species of reptile has a different personality and many are surprisingly docile around humans if they interact peacefully with people long enough. Believe it or not, they are capable of learned behavior. Caiman are less aggressive to humans than crocs or gators. This isn't to say they won't bite, but it's not as clear cut as you might think. After all, people have 30 foot constrictors as pets. The guy bought it at a pet store and he's kept it for 23 years without incident. Dogs and cats are probably more dangerous to their owners than reptiles.
@DAVID #11
Yes I'm familiar with that study-- very interesting on several levels.
I was just playing devil's advocate with regard to the domestication of caiman. It is a "possibility" that this particular caiman is less skittish. Yes, true domestication takes several generations, but it's gotta start somewhere, and occasionally a genetic mutation can be far more advanced than we think-- indeed, this caiman might not have survived in the wild ("might").
To say "reptiles cannot be tamed" is specious reasoning, and the phrase "reptilian brain" has taken on a life of it's own in some ways. Lest we forget, reptiles and birds share a common heritage (albeit millions of years ago, so it is a bit of a reach). You never know what's possible until it is attempted. I suspect it might be possible to domesticate caiman (caiMEN?), but it would take a lot of time and effort and limbs, and there doesn't appear to be any benefit or profit in it.
I DO believe someone will eventually be hurt by this caiman, but that doesn't automatically disprove my hypothesis.
Having lived with a parrot, I hesitate to accept the word "tamed". "Accommodated", "tolerated" come to mind.
A fascinating tangent to the Russian fox experiments is the distinct possibility that domestic dogs happened in ONE generation. One.
Looking at the video; being that its been 23 years owning this pet its clearly proven itself safe. He raised this cayman along with his own daughter without issue. And the gentleman does seem to genuinely take good care of the animal and love it. It even wags its tail when being pet.
Perhaps we should adjust our perspectives on how we perceive some animals regarding their intelligence.
Perhaps you should not be so anthropocentric. Do you think 23 years is any different than 23 minutes to a brain lacking most of your own layering? The animal is alive and has feelings, yes. Intelligence? Understand that if you cut open its head and removed 75% of the brain present, you wouldn't notice much difference in behaviour. Crocodilians evolved and exist to seek heat, stalk moving prey, eat without mercy,excrete and breed. Not to make cuddly with some upstart hairy mammal that probably lactates all over the place at the drop of a hat.
Fools have been eaten trying to kiss up primate style with grizzly bears, good luck with a caiman.
Rob Bredl
"Despite handling crocodiles almost every day of his life, he has only been nipped twenty seven times over more than 28 years. He calls them love bites . He has learnt more about crocodiles than most people, even swimming with the four metre giant that one day nearly took the life of his niece. Karla slipped just in the wrong place at the wrong time. Solomon, a four metre croc managed to grab and drag her into his pool. Her father, Joe Bredl jumped on to the croc inserting his fingers in its eyes. This saved her life. The crocodile received such a fright from this remarkable action that he let Karla go. Joe just had enough time to leap to safety before Solomon recovered from the fright. He has received several bravery awards from around the world for his actions. The story is the subject of the Barefoot Bushman television programme, "
I think that applying terms like "smart" and "dumb" to a reptile is about as accurate as calling one "tamed." They're programmed quite differently than we mammals, but just like other classes of creatures, I'm willing to bet that they can be desensitized to stimuli that they have learned are meaningless to their ongoing survival. It looks like this caiman is pretty desensitized to people and public interation overall. There's probably a cue, such a a specific location, that lets him know that it's feeding time. As long as he's not tricked into thinking it's feeding time when it's not, after 23 years, chances are that he's not going to become suddenly sensitive to stimuli that he has ignored for over two decades. If reptiles like to do one thing, it's conserve energy, and going after non-existent food is pretty inefficient.
Now, the croc pit & Steve Irwin, that's a whole different story...
A real-life Barny Juno, caring for the wingéd and stepping animals of the Earth :)
We're Lawful, they're Chaotic... and as you know, you can only trust a Chaotic for so long...